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    Moderated By: claudio
    Agoraquest Forum Index DVD
      
    Sony 975v DVD Player - My review and thoughts Dashboard
    Replies: 41 | Views: 10,521
    Last Reply: January 10, 2005, 8:19 pm

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    Maxxwire | boulderskies | rb | thefaulkner | twocan | kdmnguyen | bbeacham | jdown | JamisonBWolsh | DoobieWah | sondogg | blackvette | luisandres58 | btorphy | jresurf | svtec | CaptJeff1 | jsteeleii | cjjezews |
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    Author Sony 975v DVD Player - My review and thoughts
    Maxxwire
    Moderator
    Premium Member

    Rank: Sony Adept


    Joined: Aug 29, 2002
    Posts: 26067
    From: Portland, Oregon - USA

      Posted: 2004-12-23 23:37

    blackvette- The demands of high bandwidth Digital transmission is a far cry from the 14.4 volt dc electronics of an internal combustion engine.

    The real proof to whether there is a difference in transmission quality between the teflon insulated silverplated conductors of the Kimber Kable HDMI cable and a generic $13 one is to hook them both up and actually SEE if there is a difference or not and not just speculate that there is no difference.

    I have used copper, silver plated and .99999 fine silver conductor wires for the 3.3M hz Digital transmissions in the Digital front end of my Audio system and the .99999 fine silver wires are far superior to other wires as their higher bandwidth lends itself to a more accurate transmission. I say this because I have actually heard the jaw dropping difference that a high quality Digital coax can make.

    I have a hard time beleiving that a 1.4G hz Digital Video signal with 450 times as much bandwidth and a jitter tollerence of 250 picoseonds would not benefit from a high build quality wire also.

    _Maxx

    -----------------
    A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!



    The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930


         


    blackvette

    Rank: Sony Buff


    Joined: Sep 10, 2004
    Posts: 19
    From:

      Posted: 2004-12-24 00:32


    • Member Quote

    On 2004-12-23 23:37, Maxxwire wrote:
    blackvette- The demands of high bandwidth Digital transmission is a far cry from the 14.4 volt dc electronics of an internal combustion engine.



    The real proof to whether there is a difference in transmission quality between the teflon insulated silverplated conductors of the Kimber Kable HDMI cable and a generic $13 one is to hook them both up and actually SEE if there is a difference or not and not just speculate that there is no difference.



    I have used copper, silver plated and .99999 fine silver conductor wires for the 3.3M hz Digital transmissions in the Digital front end of my Audio system and the .99999 fine silver wires are far superior to other wires as their higher bandwidth lends itself to a more accurate transmission. I say this because I have actually heard the jaw dropping difference that a high quality Digital coax can make.



    I have a hard time beleiving that a 1.4G hz Digital Video signal with 450 times as much bandwidth and a jitter tollerence of 250 picoseonds would not benefit from a high build quality wire also.



    _Maxx


    The cables on an analog signal could in fact benefit from a higher grade wire.. I agree.. More fine strands of copper are better than one thick strand.

    But we are refering to Digital.. ONES and ZEROs It's either there or it's not.. Not much different than an Optical cable except for the distance limitations.

    When the transmission sucks on Digital cable or Direct TV it shows up as blocking or tiling.. Missing pixels..

    If you dont see those then the picture is as good as it's going to get..

    Gigabit Ethernet uses a single core copper wire with nothing special..

    The irony here is, why is it that these special alloys and grades of copper are so important OUTSIDE the DVD player, but inside.. The just use plain old copper wire.. Nothing is made by MONSTER in there????


       
    Maxxwire
    Moderator
    Premium Member

    Rank: Sony Adept


    Joined: Aug 29, 2002
    Posts: 26067
    From: Portland, Oregon - USA

      Posted: 2004-12-24 02:59

    Its not ironic at all that long lengths of interconnect measured in meters need an advanced grade of conductor and insulation because the signal on them travels so much farther and comes in contact with nasty influences like RFI and EMI which can seriously degrade a Digital signal. These same conditions just don't apply to 2-3 inches of wire or a circuitboard trace inside a DVD player.

    I have proven to my own satisfaction on dozens of occasions that the quality of interconnect makes a huge difference in the quality of the Digital signal transfer. Sometimes even a night and day difference when comparing an OEM wire to a .99999 fine silver wire with 9 layers of RFI/EMI sheilding.

    You might lend some credibility to your theory and actually test some different grades of Digital wires as I have and see how correct your assumption that the quality of Digital interconnects have no effect on Digital transmission whatsoever. You might be suprised at the results, I know I was.

    _Maxx

    -----------------
    A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!



    The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930


         
    rb

    Rank: Ultimate Sony Reviewer


    Joined: Mar 04, 2003
    Posts: 2035
    From: Canada

      Posted: 2004-12-24 13:11

    The quality of the wire that resides inside of the component makes a huge difference also. I have components that have been upgraded with DHLabs Silver Sonic hook-up wire internally, changed the sound for the better dramatically.

    I'm slowly replacing all of my interconnects with DHLabs Silver Sonic cables, lastly the speakers will be rewired with the same brand/kind of wire.

    I could use the $.25 cable that came in the box with my DVD player with out problem, but that's not to say upgraded wire would not improve things. I think whether the signal is digital or analog is irrelevant.
     
    High end companies don't just use plain old copper wire inside their components, they choose the wire for it's sonic characteristics, the wire is treated just like any other internal part. The designer of my power amp uses wire that was designed for use in aircrafts because it gave him the sound he was seeking to achieve.

     

    -----------------
    rb

    I listen to music in StereO

    [ This message was edited by: rb on 2004-12-24 13:17 ]


         
    Maxxwire
    Moderator
    Premium Member

    Rank: Sony Adept


    Joined: Aug 29, 2002
    Posts: 26067
    From: Portland, Oregon - USA

      Posted: 2004-12-24 15:17

    rb- I wasn't saying that internal wiring isn't important I was just trying to point out to the gentleman that conditions outside the player are much more hazardous than inside the player.

    You are right that quality wiring is importnt inside the player no matter how short the run, but outside the player there is a jungle of AC power cables, interconnects and speaker wires to navigate and this environment can prove to be particularly hazardous to Digital signals that can pick up degrading RFI very easily if they are not very well sheilded.

    The new wire that you are getting most likely has ulrta pure solid silver conductors has it also been cryo-treated?

    _Maxx

    -----------------
    A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!



    The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930


         
    rb

    Rank: Ultimate Sony Reviewer


    Joined: Mar 04, 2003
    Posts: 2035
    From: Canada

      Posted: 2004-12-24 15:22

    Maxx sorry for the confusion, I agree with you 100 %, I mentioned internal wiring only because blackvette stated that they use plain old copper inside components, no Monster cable inside, when in fact some companies are quite particular about the type and quality of the wire they choose for the internal wiring.



    -----------------
    rb

    I listen to music in StereO

    [ This message was edited by: rb on 2004-12-24 18:38 ]


         
    Maxxwire
    Moderator
    Premium Member

    Rank: Sony Adept


    Joined: Aug 29, 2002
    Posts: 26067
    From: Portland, Oregon - USA

      Posted: 2004-12-24 16:31

    Maybe part of the problem here is that blackvette is under the impression that Monster makes quality wiring.

    Here's a quote from the Moderator at the Sound and Vision Magazine Forum-

    "HDMI is a Digital transfer medium and the theory is that Digital can go on for very long runs without any degradation.

    Ultimately, the quality and construction of the HDMI wire itself is what will degrade the Video signal."

    http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/idealbb/view.asp?topicID=36372&pageNo=1

    _Maxx

    -----------------
    A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!



    The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930


         
    Maxxwire
    Moderator
    Premium Member

    Rank: Sony Adept


    Joined: Aug 29, 2002
    Posts: 26067
    From: Portland, Oregon - USA

      Posted: 2004-12-25 01:20

    rb- I just found this DH Labs Silversonic HDMI cable-

    http://www.cesweb.org/attendees/show_floor/product_locator/product_details.asp?prodid=4083

    With its silver coated conductors and foam dielectric its build quality sounds somewhat similar to the Kimber Kable HDMI cable that I was refering to.

    _Maxx

    -----------------
    A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!



    The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930


         
    bbeacham

    Rank: Sony Fanatic


    Joined: Mar 04, 2004
    Posts: 361
    From:

      Posted: 2004-12-25 17:31

    Santa (well UPS) bought me a 975v DVD player on 12/24 and I am AMAZED at how good the picture is.  The TV is a new Hitachi 57F510 that I purchased at the end of November.   My previous DVD player is a Sony DVP-S550D that I purchased in May 99 for $499.  It has worked great since I bought it so I hope the 975 equals it in longevity.   In an amazing show of engineering continuity, Sony uses the same setup menu scheme on the 975 as on the 550.  This made setting it up easier for me.

    Last night I watched "I, Robot"  and the picture was so clear and fine and detailed it was like being at the movies.  The colors are bright and vibrant.  Even the sound seemed better but now I am getting into a subjective area.

    As did another poster to the thread I bought a cheap 3 meter HDMI cable from the Computer Cable Store for $31.  At least this appears cheap compared to the 3 digit prices I was seeing elsewhere.  As the other poster said, for digital signals the cable quality, and price is certainly no indication of quality, does not matter as much as it does for an analog signal.  If the receiving device can tell the differance between a 1 and a 0 it does not matter if there has been any signal degradation.  Only when the signal is so degraded that the receiver cannot differentiate between a 1 and a 0 is there a problem.  Of course the cable cannot inject errors (change a 1 to 0, add/subtract bits) but if the receiver does a CRC check on the received data and there is a retransmission algorithim as in computer networks then even bad cables can give good results.   Don't you just love the digital world.

    These are the cable specs:


    • Eliminates unnecessary signal conversions.
    • Supports standard, enhanced, or high-definition video at 24 bits/pixel, 165MHz max clock frequency.
    • Supports up to 8 channel digital audio on a single cable eliminating costly A/D signal conversions.
    • Bi-directional control signal transfer.
    • 5 Gbps bandwidth, 55% spared for future expansion.
    • Simple, user-friendly connector.
    • Per HDMI standard, HDTV sent as 16x9 & SDTV as 4x3 over 30 AWG 100 ohm, .5 amp, 500 VAC DWV double shielded cable.
    http://www.computercablestore.com/detail.aspx?ID=2647




       
    rb

    Rank: Ultimate Sony Reviewer


    Joined: Mar 04, 2003
    Posts: 2035
    From: Canada

      Posted: 2004-12-25 18:10

    DHLabs makes some excellent cables, I buy mine from the Parts Connexion and have them terminate them, saves me bundles.

    -----------------
    rb

    I listen to music in StereO


         
    Maxxwire
    Moderator
    Premium Member

    Rank: Sony Adept


    Joined: Aug 29, 2002
    Posts: 26067
    From: Portland, Oregon - USA

      Posted: 2004-12-26 01:22

    bbeacham- So good to hear that the DVP 975 works so well for you!

    As is contained in your stats for the HDMI cable you are running the Video signal has both a Bitrate and a Clockrate (165M hz) which means if those 1's and 0's which have been clocked don't get to the processor exactly when they are supposed to then the signal will have jitter and if the jitter rate is more than the allowable number of picoseconds (about 250 trilloinths of a second I've read) then there will be errors in the picure as a result because the Data did not arrive exactly on time.

    An HDMI cable that has been built to the exacting standards of this high bandwidth interface can help to minimize the timing errors known as jitter and deliver an even more accurate Digital signal which translates into an even better picture because the data is arriving on time.

    Considering the amount of money that the owners of these Digital Monitors have already spent I would think that $X00 for a quality HDMI cable to ensure the highest quality picture would be a sound investment.

    Hopefully some brave soul will try a Premium Quality HDMI cable like the Kimber Kable or DH Labs Silver Sonic and compare it with the budget brand and compare the results.

    _Maxx

    -----------------
    A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!



    The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930


         
    thefaulkner

    Rank: Sonyphile


    Joined: Mar 07, 2003
    Posts: 499
    From: Calgary, Ab

      Posted: 2004-12-26 02:12

    I'll let everyone in on this BEFORE it gets out of hand...

    There seems to be an issue with the DVPNS975V.  I ran into two different units the same day that seemed to lock their tray on their own, and will not let you unlock it with the standard dealer codes.  The player quits responding altogether and does not let you do anything.   I figure it's an IC, but haven't been able to localize the exact culprit.   Perhaps this is two isolated incidents, but I found it a bit coincidental to hear about these two players an hour apart. 

    If this happens to you, you can get your disc out by moving that small plastic "cap" that is on the bottom front of the unit, below the tray.  Using a narrow tool, you can slide the tray override to open the tray.  Do not try to "fix" the unit yourself, you will void your warranty by tampering.  (And you don't want to void your Sony Warranty... You did buy it from an authorized dealer... didn't you???  DIDN'T YOU????)

    I don't know if Sony is aware of the problem yet... I have submitted information to them on it, but I assume that they don't have any resolve yet.  There is no bulletins on ESI about this problem.

    If you have a "bad" player, follow Sony's directions to exchange your unit via Sony's "Peace of Mind" program... but don't jump the gun!!!! If your unit isn't failing, don't get it exchanged yet, because the exchanged unit will be no different from the one you would have... yet.

    My final suggestion... Do not complain about Sony, threaten to sue Sony, claim that you are "never going to buy Sony", or take any similar action.  Just like the STRDAX000 problems of months past, Sony will remedy the situation, and please give them time to come up with a solution. 

    I will try to keep you all informed if and when more information becomes available.

    It is a nice unit that is well put together.  A nice peice of hardware from SamSony.


       
    kdmnguyen

    Rank: Sony Fan


    Joined: Dec 10, 2003
    Posts: 3
    From:

      Posted: 2004-12-30 18:05



    Hi,

    I have KF-60WE610 with one DVI input which is being used by my Disk Network HDTV SAT box. Can I get 1080i on component connection? or am I better off with the 875v?

    Thanks,

    Kevin


       
    bbeacham

    Rank: Sony Fanatic


    Joined: Mar 04, 2004
    Posts: 361
    From:

      Posted: 2004-12-30 18:47

    You need to use the HDMI output to get the 1080i display.  Which I might add looks great. 



       
    CaptJeff1

    Rank: Sony Fan


    Joined: Dec 31, 2004
    Posts: 2
    From:

      Posted: 2004-12-31 02:57

    Faulkner, just tonight I ran into this very problem on my brand new dvpns975v.  I've played maybe 10-15 movies on it with no problem and all of a sudden I'm unable to remove a disc with the "Tray Locked" message.  I tried the "narrow tool" trick without success.  I bought the unit on Ebay, what do you suggest?


       
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