| Topic Review |
Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
 |  Posted: 2006-04-12 14:27
Introducing the Townshend Seismic Sink-
The Description
The Seismic Sink is an offshoot of the pneumatic suspension built into Austrailian designer Max Townshend's $4,800 Rock Reference Turntable.
The Seismic Sink is composed of a 1/8" thicksteel top plate. It is dampend with a sheet of EAR Isodamp which is a visacelastic constrained-layer material sandwitched between the top plate and the isolator section.
Using a constrained damping assembly adds some mass while both partially attentuating the metal top plate's resonance and those vibrations originating above the isolators-ie. from the component and acoustic coupling.The upper plinth is decoupled from and floats above the base which is made from steel and MDF.
The base houses the decuopling air bladder. There is a filling valve on the rear for adding air with the hand pump or or subtracting air as need.
The Seismic Sink measures 17" X 14" X 2", weighs 21 lbs, will support equipment weighing up to 35 lbs and has a verticle Resonant frequency of 1 hz.
The Installation
Since BDR Cones work best when coupling Audio equipment to the Seismic Sink I simply removed the Granite Energy Sink that I was using and replaced it with the Seismic Sink and coupled my Counterpoint Hybrid Tube Preamp to it with the #3 BDR Cones.
At first the Siesmic Sink had too little air in it and it sounded worse than with the Granite Sink, but after a few pumps of air I began do hear why this type of pneumatic device worked so well on a $4,800 Turntable.
After properly adjusting the air pressure and the weight of the Preamp I did some serious listening.
Listening Impressions
The first thing I noticed was that the Attack Transients had become very clear and focused with a heightnening of their detailing which had also taken on a silky smoothness.
When using the properly pumped Seismic Sink the Attack Ambients took on a liveliness the likes of which I have never heard before in recorded Music as they blossomed and bloomed freely for the first time in my Audio system.
The biggest change by far though was in the Decay Envelopes! I've heard many people say that Recorded Music can't sound as good as Live Music, well now I have positive proof that they are dead wrong!
The Decay Envelopes in the Music since installing the Seismic Sink now linger naturally exactly the way they would in a Live Performance! When I first heard this I sat there with my jaw in my lap as I played CD after CD and it was the same on every recording!
The Attack Ambients and Decay Envelopes had been freed of the consrtaints that they had been operating under which were Resonance induced and the installation of the Seismic Sink now gave the Music the feeling of being as alive as they were in the venue where they were originally recorded!
DIY Applications
The reason that I put this post here in the DIY section is that a DIY version of the Seismic Sink can easily and cheaply be made since the air bladder is a simple rubber innertube.
In fact I'm considering turning the 18" X 12" Granite slab I was using under the Preamp and a 12" innertube into a simplified version of the Seismic Sink to use under my Tube Power Amp since a Seismic Sink large enough to support the Conrad-Johnson Power Amp would cost $565.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
[ This message was edited by: Maxxwire on 2010-05-06 02:05 ]
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jttar
Sony Master
Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
 | Posted: 2006-04-12 22:50
Maxx,
Thanks for sharing your experience with your new Townshend Seismic Sink. I especially appreciated the thorough description and your listening impressions. It really does sound like an impressive tweak. I only wish that we lived closer.
For the DIY Sink, will you place the inner tube on your rack with the 18" X 12" Granite slab on top of the tube and then your CJ amp on top of the granite using the BDR cones under it? Just trying to picture it in my minds eye.
Joe (aka BeastMaster)
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-13 01:44
BeastMaster- I've tried decoupling with air bladders in the past without much success which may have been due to the fact that I did not couple the equipment to a rigid high mass platform supported by the air bladder, but rather simply placed the air bladder directly under the equipment.
This time I will try using the BDR #3 Cones to couple the Power Amp to a rigid high mass platform in the form of the Granite slab and then suspend it on a properly inflated innertube which will act as the air bladder.
I have eveything except for the 12" innertube so it shouldn't cost much to see if this set up is as effective as the Townshend Seismic Sink or not.
At the very least it will be worth the effort to save the $565 that the appropriate Heavy Duty Seismic Sink would cost to decouple the Power Amp.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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rb
Ultimate Sony Reviewer
Joined: Mar 04, 2003
Posts: 2035
From: Canada
 | Posted: 2006-04-13 11:25
Great review Maxx. Sounds like it does the business. Would it be possible to see photos of the inside. It appears that the two sections just lift away from each other. Is that correct? What type of feet does it use?
-----------------
rb
I listen to music in StereO
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-13 14:49
Rick- Every piece of Audio equipment that I have ever purchased had a set of screws that could be used to take it apart, but the Seismic Sink is quite different in that there is not one assembly screw visable on this piece.
Even the 4 feet which are made from hard rubber are riveted on which may be part of the mechanism that keeps the top of the Seismic Sink attached.
Believe me if I could have figured out a way to disassemble the Seismic Sink you would already have the pictures of its internal workings, but these Auzzies are very rescourcefull and when they don't want you to get into something you might as well consider it a sealed Mystery!
In my original post I included a description of the inner workings and materials components of the Seismic Sink taken directly from the Stereophile review which is the most comprehensive description of its inner workings that I have been able to locate and probably a better description of the materials involved than a set of pictures would reveal if I could manage to get it apart to take them.
One thing I do know and that is that using the Seismic Sink under my Preamp has brought a level of fidelity and resolution to my Audio system that I had no idea even existed
before.
The Seismic Sink has allowed the ambient qualities of the low level detail to manifest themselves in a way that makes the Music sound positively true to life!
By removing the last artifacts of Resonance induced Detail Smearing this air cushion has allowed all the recorded sounds of the Original Musical Event to blossom to life in a most realistic and absolutely convincing way!
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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mykyll2727
Sony Pro
Joined: Apr 30, 2004
Posts: 4171
From: Las Vegas
 | Posted: 2006-04-13 20:58
Maxx_Great review. Thanks I'd never heard of it. Where can someone purchase one of these?_MMMike
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jttar
Sony Master
Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
| Posted: 2006-04-13 22:38
Maxx,
Just in case you haven't seen it, THIS is an article on your new Townshend Seismic Sink by Max Townshend of Townshend Audio.
Joe (aka BeastMaster)
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jttar
Sony Master
Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
| Posted: 2006-04-13 22:45
On 2006-04-13 20:58, mykyll2727 wrote:
Maxx_Great review. Thanks I'd never heard of it. Where can someone purchase one of these?_MMMike
MMMike,
I checked Best Buy and Circuit City but neither one carries them.
Of course, I'm kidding. Apparently, these platforms are very difficult to find here in the States. Townshend is a UK based company and I was unable to find any US dealers.
Joe (aka BeastMaster)
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-14 02:53
On 2006-04-13 20:58, mykyll2727 wrote:
Maxx_Great review. Thanks I'd never heard of it. Where can someone purchase one of these?_MMMike
MMMike- As Joe pointed out Townshend Audio is based in the UK and these are the only current prices I have been able to find. Remember the prices listed are in English Pounds.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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mykyll2727
Sony Pro
Joined: Apr 30, 2004
Posts: 4171
From: Las Vegas
| Posted: 2006-04-14 13:41
Maxx_Thanks for the link. WOW!!! That stand sure is something. The design of the Seismic sink has encouraged me to try a DIY platform idea I've been considering for some time. I have some Sorbothane sheets on the way so now I'll give it a try._MMMike
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-14 19:10
I found out this morning that I had seriously underestimated the Pneumatic Decoupling properties of the Seismic Sink!
I rigid coupled the Seismic Sink with a set of BDR Mk.3 Cones and...
OMG!
The Transparency, Resolution and all of the sonic improvements they bring which I described in detail earlier after the initial instalation DOUBLED!
Excuse me while I kiss the sky!
My only expanation is that the more highly Resonance Tuned an Audio system is the more sensitive it is to fine tuning.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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jttar
Sony Master
Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
| Posted: 2006-04-14 23:08
Maxx,
Unbelievable!!! I can only imagine the thrill your feeling after rigid coupling your Seismic Sink. I am really happy that the "bladder buoy" has made such a dramatic difference for you. All your time and hard work has proved worth it once again.
Joe (aka BeastMaster)
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-14 23:33
On 2006-04-14 13:41, mykyll2727 wrote:
Maxx_Thanks for the link. WOW!!! That stand sure is something. The design of the Seismic sink has encouraged me to try a DIY platform idea I've been considering for some time. I have some Sorbothane sheets on the way so now I'll give it a try._MMMike
I can't say exactly what effect it will have in your system, but the potential for substantial sonic benefits certainly justify your effort to perfect your own customized version of a Pneumatic Decoupling
device specifically tailored to the needs of your Audio equipment.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-14 23:43
On 2006-04-14 23:08, jttar wrote:
Maxx,
Unbelievable!!! I can only imagine the thrill your feeling after rigid coupling your Seismic Sink. I am really happy that the "bladder buoy" has made such a dramatic difference for you. All your time and hard work has proved worth it once again.
Joe (aka BeastMaster)
Fortunately the 430+ equipment and wiring upgrades along with the 120+ incremental Resonance Tuning upgrades I did on each of the 21 pieces of equipment in my Stereo system I did over the last 6 years combined to pave the way for the installation and Rigid Coupling of the Seismic Sink which proved to be the SONIC MOTHER LOADE!
Joe, this Stereo system now sounds so good that it makes me weep when I listen to it not only because it sounds so good, but because all those thousands of hours I spent working on it paid off in a way that turned out to exceed even my wildest expectation.
Despite this much appreciate outcome I still think that there is no greater joy than getting an original idea, implementing it and discovering that it improves the sound of your Audio system no matter how small that improvement might be.
They say that the journey is the destination, and I agree.
~Maxx~
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
One Half of My A/V System
[ This message was edited by: Maxxwire on 2006-04-15 01:33 ]
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-15 05:31
I can't stop wondering what my Tube Power Amp would sound like with Pneumatic Decoupling.
I found a guy named Bicycle Don on eBay who sells a 12" X 2.125" rubber innertube for $2.79.
I may get a couple from him unless I find them locally first and see if putting one of them under an 18" X 12" X 5/8" piece of Granite and placing the Tube Amp on it will approximate the effect that the Seismic Sink had on the Preamp.
~Maxx~
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
One Half of My A/V System
[ This message was edited by: Maxxwire on 2006-04-15 05:42 ]
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jttar
Sony Master
Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
| Posted: 2006-04-15 23:06
Maxx,
I can relate to the emotions that can sweep over us when listening to music. Whether it's the beauty of the composition or the appreciation of the system it's playing on, there are times when the music can move one to tears.
I will be most interested how the inner tube project works on your CJ power amp. If it is a success, Bicycle Don could be the new Stuart (Captnstarstripe) here on Agoraquest.
Joe (aka BeastMaster)
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-16 02:51
I was also very interested to know what the results of pneumatically decoupling the CJ Power Amp would be so I went to the nearest bicycle shop and picked up two 12" X 2.125" inner tubes for $5 each and a pump for $17.50.
I placed an inflated inner tube on the Power Amp's 1" thick Marble base and a 12" X 18" X 5/8" piece of Granite on top of the inner tube.
I then coupled the Power Amp to the Granite slab with BDR Mk3 Cones and balanced it.
I then listened to the Musical performance of the rigidly coupled Power Amp after its base had been pneumatically decoupled.
Suprisingly enough the sound was somewhat similar to straight rigid coupling, but unfortunately the leading edges of notes had become dulled and the portrayal of venue ambience was stunted. Some of the inner detail had also dissapeared.
Sadly I removed the inner tube and left the Granite slab gravity coupled to the Marble pedistal.
I then listened to the Stereo system again with the Power Amp rigidly coupled as it originally was only coupled to the Granite slab. That great sound that I had worked so many years to get was baaaack!
I had hopes of this experiment working better, but there is just no predicting how Resonance Tuning is going to turn out until you apply it and field test it.
I am not dissapointed though because I plan on trying pneumatic decoupling on other pieces of equipment in my Audio system over the next few weeks.
I think that I'm going to have many hours of cheap entertainment with this project considering I only have $27.50 invested in it. And who knows, pneumatic decoupling may improve a weak link that now exists somewhere in the Resonance Tuning of the system that I'm not even aware of yet.
If I do find just 1 viable application the upgrade will be worth many times the money I have invested.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
[ This message was edited by: Maxxwire on 2010-05-03 17:59 ]
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rb
Ultimate Sony Reviewer
Joined: Mar 04, 2003
Posts: 2035
From: Canada
| Posted: 2006-04-16 12:30
This is all very interesting. Maxx do keep us up to date with your experiment.
-----------------
rb
I listen to music in StereO
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-16 15:58
Thanks for your support Rick.
Over the last 6 years I have had hundereds of such failures in my Resonance Tuning experiment. The positive side of such a failure is learning that a particular application does not produce positive effects on that piece of equipment.
By eliminating enough ways that don't work eventually the one way that works best will be discovered.
There is a reason they call this method "Trial and error" and not "Trial and success"!
The benefits of successful Resonance Tuning escalate with the number of successful Resonance Modifications that have been made.
This week I experienced the most dramatic upgrade in Resolution and Transparency ever as a result of building upon the 120+ successfull upgrades I had already made.
The best part about Resonance Tuning is continually discovering new and astonishing levels of Realistic Musical Playback that you had no idea even existed before!
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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jttar
Sony Master
Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
| Posted: 2006-04-16 23:18
Maxx,
Thanks so much for the detailed explanation of the inner tube experiment. I'm sorry to hear that it wasn't the success you hoped for. I think that I know you well enough to be assured that you tried different amounts of inflation of the tube giving it every chance possible.
I sincerely hope that you can find an application in your system in which the tube will work not because of the price of the tube and pump but because I think the concept has potential.
Again, thanks for being the fore runner and your always honest evaluation.
Joe (aka BeastMaster)
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-04-17 04:14
Failure is a relative concept. The pneumatic decoupling of the Power Amp was only judged a failure because it was a slightly inferior application to the one I am currently using.
If I had tried using pneumatic decouping with the inner tube on the Power Amp 2 years ago I would have judged it a resounding success because it would have worked much better than the Resonance Modification I was using at the time.
Its not that the inner tube didn't work well because it actually worked extremely well just not quite as well as the rigid coupling that is currently in place.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-03 02:36
Has anyone else here ever tried using a small inner tube for the pneumatic decoupling of Audio equipment?
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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RickeyM
Sony King
Joined: Sep 09, 2004
Posts: 1408
From: Baltimore, Maryland
 |  Posted: 2006-05-03 22:54
I have one under my CDP but I have tried an A/B test to see if there's a difference. I want to add a piece of wood of some sort attached to the bottom plate for some added rigidty and mass too.
-----------------
Graduate of Sony University, class of '94.
Support your local S.P.C.A. Adopt
If older is better, I must be approaching magnificence!
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-04 02:37
High mass, rigdity and dampening are the qualities you would be looking for in a platform to go between your CD Player and the pneumatic decoupler.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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RickeyM
Sony King
Joined: Sep 09, 2004
Posts: 1408
From: Baltimore, Maryland
| Posted: 2006-05-05 01:07
What would work better in the inner tube, er, bladder, high pressure or low?
-----------------
Graduate of Sony University, class of '94.
Support your local S.P.C.A. Adopt
If older is better, I must be approaching magnificence!
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-05 03:28
RickeyM- The most common advice I have read is not to over inflate.
You might start with just enough pressure in the PDD (Pneumatic Decoupling Device) to adequately support the CDP and incrementaly add air until you feel that you are getting the best response.
What type of rigid high mass platform did you put under the CDP and how is it coupled to it?
I will be very interested in hearing about the results you get.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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RickeyM
Sony King
Joined: Sep 09, 2004
Posts: 1408
From: Baltimore, Maryland
|  Posted: 2006-05-07 00:27
What type of rigid high mass platform did you put under the CDP and how is it coupled to it?
I will be very interested in hearing about the results you get.
~Maxx~
...Still working on that. Been kinda busy with my MMG mods (including external x-o boxes), experimental room treatments, asst home projects, PC desk project, etc.
-----------------
Graduate of Sony University, class of '94.
Support your local S.P.C.A. Adopt
If older is better, I must be approaching magnificence!
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RickeyM
Sony King
Joined: Sep 09, 2004
Posts: 1408
From: Baltimore, Maryland
|  Posted: 2006-05-07 00:30
Really, really busy with the desk....
-----------------
Graduate of Sony University, class of '94.
Support your local S.P.C.A. Adopt
If older is better, I must be approaching magnificence!
|
Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-08 02:32
RickeM- That's one nice finish you put on that wood! What kind of wood is it and what did you use for a topcoat?
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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RickeyM
Sony King
Joined: Sep 09, 2004
Posts: 1408
From: Baltimore, Maryland
| Posted: 2006-05-08 09:28
Thanks for the compliment on the finish. The wood is simply a cut down 2'x4' quarter-inch "Handy-Panel" from Home Depot, glued onto a piece of MDF. I picked the Handy-Panel because veneer is expensive and if I botched this, I was only out a $4 piece of plywood.
The base is Minwax Polyshades Classic Oak (four coats) and Minwax polyurethane on top (three coats so far). Yesterday I got the top sanded down smooth and ready for a couple of finish coats.
I read about wet sanding the final coat with #400 grit and Lemon oil or Mineral oil. Any other suggestions? This is my first "fine finish" project  .
Back to that CDP, I'm thinking of adding a layer of Dynamat type material on the bottom. Then experimenting with some wood shelving or MDF fastened to the bottom.
-----------------
Graduate of Sony University, class of '94.
Support your local S.P.C.A. Adopt
If older is better, I must be approaching magnificence!
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-08 14:52
Hail the power of Minwax! I used several coats of Minwax #209 Natural as a topcoat on the American Walnut finished cabinets my JBL speakers over 8 years ago and I haven't had to put Lemon oil or Mineral oil on them even once.
The Dynamat should add the dampening that is recommended along with a high mass rigid platform in the application of pneumatic decoupling.
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
Explore The New Sony MaxxPix
[ This message was edited by: Maxxwire on 2010-05-03 18:06 ]
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mykyll2727
Sony Pro
Joined: Apr 30, 2004
Posts: 4171
From: Las Vegas
| Posted: 2006-05-13 18:55
Maxx_I'd like to trouble you for exactly how you have your speakers coupled/decoupled. I'm doing some experimenting myself (What else is new ) and would like to apply your method to see what results I get._MMMike
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-14 02:30
MMMike- The Granite slab is placed on Hybrid Sorbothane footers for Decoupling and a set of BDR Mk3 Cones Rigid Couple the Speaker to the Granite energy sink.
I took this picture after I went from Gravity Coupling to Rigid Coupling the Speakers, but the Cones didn't show up at all.
For me the BDR Cones really improved² the sound of the JBL's! I supect that this was because the speakers were designed to be used "Studio Style" with the transducers in a horizontal array and Gravity Coupling was stifiling their true sonic potential because the speakers were so close to the rigid mass of the Energy Sink.
I hope that your Speaker re-Tuning project goes well. Sometimes Resonance Tuning works best the the 2nd, 3rd, or even 4th time around.
My history with the JBL's started with Rigid Coupling them, then I switched to Decoupling and now I find a combination of the two methods the works simply fantastic²! Go figure!
~Maxx~
-----------------
A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
Explore The New Sony MaxxPix
[ This message was edited by: Maxxwire on 2010-05-03 18:11 ]
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mykyll2727
Sony Pro
Joined: Apr 30, 2004
Posts: 4171
From: Las Vegas
| Posted: 2006-05-14 02:43
Maxx_Thanks. That explains alot of what I wanted to know. Just one thing the granite is decoupled with Sorbo but what does the Sorbo rest on?_MMMike
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-14 03:51
MMMike- The Hybrid Sorbothane sits on a large metal stand.
I used to read about guys who combined Coupling and Decoupling and I thought "yeah, sure, you betcha!".
Now that I've learned why they were doing it I've realize that its not wise to criticize a methodology until you find out if it works for you or not. Had I been wiser I could have saved a lot of time and tried this earlier.
~Maxx~
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A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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mykyll2727
Sony Pro
Joined: Apr 30, 2004
Posts: 4171
From: Las Vegas
| Posted: 2006-05-14 15:56
On 2006-05-14 03:51, Maxxwire wrote:
MMMike- The Hybrid Sorbothane sits on a large metal stand.
I used to read about guys who combined Coupling and Decoupling and I thought "yeah, sure, you betcha!".
Now that I've learned why they were doing it I've realize that its not wise to criticize a methodology until you find out if it works for you or not. Had I been wiser I could have saved a lot of time and tried this earlier.
~Maxx~
Thank you sir. That's what I wanted to know. Mike VansEvers at one point suggested I try using rigid coupling and decoupling together. I remember having the same thought as you about it's results. But like you I've learned that I must really try something before I decide that it won't work. Alot of what I thought wouldn't did. Your metal stands are an example. My first inclination is that it would make the sound too bright. But I've learned I can't always go by my first impression. Trust me I'll be giving it a try. BTW I'm already using both techniques together under my speakers and some components with very positive results. Now to fine tune it all._MMMike
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-14 16:21
The first thing I tried on my Preamp was Decoupling with Sorbothane, then I tried coupling it with Brass Cones, then I went back to Decoupling with a DIY Air Bladder, from there I went to Amuminum Cones, but I finally got my first real Audible upgrades with BDR Mk3 Cones!
21 months later I tried Pneumatic Decoupling the Preamp again with the Townshend Seismic Sink and the sound quality increased an Order of Magnitude. The next Order of Magnitude was reached when I used a set of BDR Mk3 Cones to Couple the Seismic Sink to its stand!
Sometimes it can be a royal pain trying to find the very best method of Resonance Tuning, but when you finally do find it the rewards are not only spectacular but satisfying in knowing that you have finally found the one and only road that could have take your Audio system to this level of excellence!
~Maxx~
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A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-14 16:36
On 2006-05-14 15:56, mykyll2727 wrote:Your metal stands are an example. My first inclination is that it would make the sound too bright. But I've learned I can't always go by my first impression.
MMMike- If the stands were perfect I wouldn't have had to alter anything.
It seems as though the Hybrid Surbothane, 30 lb Granite slabs and BDR Cones have staightened things right out though!
Like when Mike Vans Evers said that its not the goal to eliminate Resonance, but rather to Tune it to our advantage so it isn't clumped up at detrimental fequencies but spread out evenly across the spectrum. This may be the advantage that combining Rigid Coupling and Decoupling has.
~Maxx~
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A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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mykyll2727
Sony Pro
Joined: Apr 30, 2004
Posts: 4171
From: Las Vegas
| Posted: 2006-05-16 13:55
Maxx_Those Sorbothane sheets that you pointed out and posted a link to have been a godsend for me. I haven't worked out everything yet but have they ever hepled. Thanks so much my friend. I owe you another one. I haven't got the speaker issues completely worked out but I'm well on my way. As far as my DIY isolation platforms they've proven to be just what the doctor ordered. Pretty much have that just right. I still have more testing to do. I'll post my results._MMMike
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mykyll2727
Sony Pro
Joined: Apr 30, 2004
Posts: 4171
From: Las Vegas
| Posted: 2006-05-16 14:25
Maxx_I almost forgot. I tried the Sorbo sheets all over my K90s. Underneath, on top, even taped to the sides. The result is that now more than ever I'm convinced that replacing/upgrading the internal stock damping materials will produce outstanding results. I'm very excited about the prospects._MMMike
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-05-19 15:00
The other day I was thinking back on my latest Resonance Tuning upgrades and it occured to me that before I finally found some success at Resonance Tuning the very expensive Audio equipment that I hear down at the Audio shop which I use as a Reference because it is my only easily accessable source of high quality sound all sounded much better than what I had at home.
The first round of Resonance Tuning in the summer of 2004 brought my Audio system up to the sound quality level of the High End equipment in the Audio shop and the addition of my CJ Power Amp and 3 wiring upgrades put me over the top in sound quality for the very first time.
These last few Resonance Tuning upgrades which cost me $185 to implement have now improved the sound of this exact same set equipment and wiring to levels far exceeding what the far more expensive Audio equipment can achieve with the set up it has.
I'm not trying to say that my Audio system is all that great I'm just trying to point out that Resonance Tuning has been responsable for these dramatic sonic improvements without any equipment or wiring upgrades while the Resonsonce Tuning was being applied.
~Maxx~
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A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2006-07-05 13:06
Its been 3 months now since I Pneumatically Decoupled the Preamp and I can still hear the effects of this upgrade in the sound quality of the Audio system as I listen to the Power Amp Mod that was done 2½ weeks ago break in.
Its easy to tell when listening that each of these upgrades has brought its own distinct set of sonic improvements to the overall sound quality of the Audio system that endure and serve to enhance the upgrades and Modifications that follow in their own unique way.
~Maxx~
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A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2008-02-05 01:24
Last week while I was doing my regular electrical contact maintanance using Killer Contact Cleaner and Pro Gold Contact Enhancer I took the opportunity to take a picture of the Townshend Seismic Sink Pneumatic Decoupler as it sits below the Preamp with a set of #3 BDR Carbon Fiber Cones Coupling the two pieces.
Its been almost 2 years now since I installed the Seismic Sink and I created this Thread to share the good news of the amazing sonic benefits that combining both Rigid Coupling and Pneumatic Decoupling can have.
The Townshend Seismic Sink is the stand alone version of the original Audio Equipment pneumatic decoupling device that was created by Austrailian Max Townshend for his supurb $4,800 Rock Reference Turntable. There are many very crucial areas of Audio Technology which the Austrailians have pioneered and this is but one of them.
I've certainly gotten every penny and more of value in terms of radically² improved sound quality from the $90 I spent on my Townshend Seismic Sink even in the short time I've had it.
~Maxx~
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A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
[IMG]http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Maxxwire_Photos/AQ/N.png[/IMG]
[url=http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=26561&forum=51&start=540&select_page_number=37]The OCCC Furu-Charged Sony DB 930[/url]
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2011-06-09 22:20
This picture shows how the air bladder inside the Townshend Seismic Sink is inflated to provide pheumatic decoupling.
~Maxx~
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A Satisfied Sony Fan Since 1974!
... The Sony DB 930 Legend Continues
Sony H-9 MaxxPix
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Maxxwire
Sony Adept
Joined: Aug 29, 2002
Posts: 25729
From: Portland, Oregon - USA
| Posted: 2011-06-30 16:10
Lately I've been contemplating using the Townsend Seismic Sink to Pneumatically Decouple my Sony DB 930 Receiver after its recent 7 months of AC Power Delivery Network upgrades have more fully broken in.
~Maxx~
 Sony H-9 MaxxPix
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