Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2004-12-18 00:53
I am narrowed down my choice to the buying either the Grand Wega 55XS955 or the 60WF655. Both sets have an awesome picture and sell for the same price. So it comes down to going with the larger picture of the 60 inch WF or the smaller 55 inch XS, that has a few upgrades such as better speakers, a 2nd HDMI input and additional video adjustments you can make. The speakers probably do not make much difference to me because I run everything through my sound system. I like the styling a little more of the XS but the 60 inch is really nice. I sit anywhere from 12.5 feet to 15 feet from our TV, so a 60 inch set is not too big.
What would you do? I keep going back-and-forth on these two models and I am having a difficult time deciding which one offers the best value. Let me know your thoughts. I really need your help
Toli Sony Master Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 8509
From: Winthrop Harbor, IL USA
Posted: 2004-12-18 08:26 Jagster1- They are both really, really nice TVs. But how is the lighting in the TV room? If bright light or alot of windows are a concern, the KDF-60WF655 has a less reflective screen but I think that the KDF-55XS955 is so cool looking, it also comes in a 60" model.
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2004-12-18 11:25
Hi Toli, thanks or your reply. Our family room is in the basement so it is pretty dark. No direct lighting. I thought both the XS and WF have the same non-reflective screen, but maybe I am wrong. My big dilemma is should I go with the larger screen since we sit back pretty far from the TV or go with the slightly better enhancements of the XS model. I cannot get the 60 inch XS model because is out of my price range, plus I plan on getting the TV at Crutchfield where they are offering for free the matching Sony stand for the 55XS or the 60WF. What would you do? I am leaning towards the bigger screen (at least for next 5 minutes, until I change my mind again).
Toli Sony Master Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 8509
From: Winthrop Harbor, IL USA
Posted: 2004-12-18 15:51 Jagster1- I checked online at www.crutchfield.com and between the 60" XS model and the 50" XS model, there is only a $400 difference. I know there is only so much money to go around, but what I would do is find a way to swing the extra $400, especially if I really liked the TV. The WF model is really nice too, so it wouldn't be like you're losing out, unless you don't get the model that you really wanted. Try calling Rhonda at Crutchfield, here is her number 1-800-388-2911, ext. 4068. Maybe she can work out a deal for you. Or what might be even better, call www.oade.com they are also an authorized Sony dealer, they have great prices and excellent customer service, they may even be able to get you a better deal on the 60" XS with the stand than at Crutchfield. I would highly recommend checking out both these angles (especially Oade) before making a decision.
jttar Sony Master Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
Posted: 2004-12-18 22:38
If you can follow up on Toli's suggestions and get a better price on the 60XS955 that would be the way to go but if it comes down to your original decision between the 55XS955 or the 60WF655 I would let the need of a second HDMI be the deciding factor. You already stated that you don't need the speakers so if you also don't need the extra HDMI imput I would go with the 60WF655. I spent many hours on line and in front of the same two TV sets and was hard pressed to see a difference in the PQ after setting their video adjustments the same. You have the room for a 60" and I would go as large as you can afford.
Joe
Toli Sony Master Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 8509
From: Winthrop Harbor, IL USA
Posted: 2004-12-18 23:01
Joe,
I agree with you, I don't really think that really I saw a difference between the two, although when I saw the TVs they weren't next to each other. My thinking was that he shouldn't give up on the 60" XS if that was the TV he would really like for a few hundred dollars, because he could probably get a good deal from Oade or even Crutchfield, that would allow him to make that purchase. ----------------- KDL-52XBR6 w/Salamander Archetype TV65,STR-DA7100ES,BDP-S1,DVP-NS9100ES,DIRECTV HR21,Panamax 5510-PRO ACRegenerator & M1500-UPS;Klipsch:KSF-10.5(2),KSF-C5,KSF-S5(4-2),KSW-15; glass toslinks,Pure Silver i-Link & HDMI,PS3,Harmony 880 Pro
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2004-12-19 01:57
Jttar and Toli thank you so much for your posts. I really appreciate the advice. I am going to call Oade on Monday (they are closed on the weekends) and see what deal they can give me on the 60XS with the Sony stand. I agree with you guys that the bigger set is nicer and if I can swing the XS I will do that due to the extra HDMI input and Advance picture setting. I have compared the XS and the WF side by side and I have not seen any difference, and based on what I have read they have the exact same Grand Wega, same bulb, same chips, the only picture difference being the Live Color and advance settings.
You guys have been terrific. Really appreciate all the helpful advice.
Toli Sony Master Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 8509
From: Winthrop Harbor, IL USA
Posted: 2004-12-19 08:38 Jagster1- Good luck and let us know how things turn out and which TV you get. Don't be surprised if Oade gets you a better deal on the KDF-60XS955 with the stand than Crutchfield did on the KDF-55XS955 with the stand, you may even have enough for an extended warranty. ----------------- KDL-52XBR6 w/Salamander Archetype TV65,STR-DA7100ES,BDP-S1,DVP-NS9100ES,DIRECTV HR21,Panamax 5510-PRO ACRegenerator & M1500-UPS;Klipsch:KSF-10.5(2),KSF-C5,KSF-S5(4-2),KSW-15; glass toslinks,Pure Silver i-Link & HDMI,PS3,Harmony 880 Pro
jttar Sony Master Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
Posted: 2004-12-19 21:56
On 2004-12-18 23:01, Toli wrote: My thinking was that he shouldn't give up on the 60" XS if that was the TV he would really like for a few hundred dollars,
Toli,
Isn't that the truth. I can tell you how many times in the past that I was kicking myself for not spending a more money and purchasing what I really wanted instead of buying a lesser product right then. In the long run you end up wishing you did or taking a loss upgrading later on.
Jagster1,
Let us know how things work out.
Joe
Toli Sony Master Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 8509
From: Winthrop Harbor, IL USA
Posted: 2004-12-20 18:46 Jagster1- Have you called Oade yet, if so what did they say? I just checked my email and they sent me a good price for you, but it wasn't exact because they don't know your exact address.
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2004-12-20 20:38
Hi Toli, I did call them today. They gave me a price for the 60XS of $3,659 delivered and the Sony stand for $379 plus an estimated $70 for shipping. One thing they do not offer is financing through Sony. Right now Sony has 18 months no interest, no payments. An offer that is hard to refuse. I am curious, what price did they quote you for the 60XS? I really appreciate all your work Toli. You have been great.
Toli Sony Master Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 8509
From: Winthrop Harbor, IL USA
Posted: 2004-12-20 20:58 Jagster1- You are welcome, I email someone from there often, so it's no trouble at all. Oade sales did email me about the same price, but they left out a few details. I emailed them back trying to convince them to get you a better offer. Please don't make a decision until I hear back from them tomorrow. I'll post the results as soon as I hear back, keep your fingers crossed.
btorphy Sony Buff Joined: Dec 01, 2004
Posts: 13
From: The Windy City
Posted: 2004-12-21 11:31
For what its wotrth I just bought (and was delivered on Saturday) a 60XS from Abt. I paid $3300 and they incldued a 3 year warrantee. I opted to upgrade to the 4 year becasue it included the bulb.
What a fabulous picture! I coupled it with the 975 DVD player and could not be happier. I would pay the extra$ if for no other reason that to get the extra HDMI input.
Barry
Toli Sony Master Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 8509
From: Winthrop Harbor, IL USA
Posted: 2004-12-21 19:47 Jagster1- I heard back from Oade, Crutchfield was still the better deal. Did you happen to call Rhonda at Crutchfield to see if she could work out a deal with the stand for you on the 60" XS, so you could still get the deal on the financing? Here is her number: 1-800-388-2911 X4068, she is off on Tuesdays and Thursdays. If you do talk to her please tell her that I sent you.
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2004-12-21 23:54
Hi Toli, thank you for telling me about Rhonda's schedule. I tried calling her several times today and each time I got her voice mail. Now that I know she is in on Wednesdays, I will try again tomorrow. I will be a name dropper and tell her I got her name from you. We will see what she can do on the 60XS or even on the 60WF. I have not really dealt with Crutchfield before. Do you know if they negotiate at all with their stated prices or are do they tell you their advertise price is their price?
Take care!
Toli Sony Master Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 8509
From: Winthrop Harbor, IL USA
Posted: 2004-12-22 00:49 Jagster1- Check your Agoraquest inbox when you have a chance.
Fade2Black Sony Enthusiant Joined: Dec 04, 2004
Posts: 40
From: The Black Hole Of Cygnas X-1
Posted: 2004-12-22 17:53
This months issue of the high end video magazine, "The Perfect Vision" has an excellent review of the 55XS955.............
I am real close to getting the 60XS955, so I would vote to get that one.........
[ This message was edited by: Fade2Black on 2004-12-22 17:56 ]
davemtp Sony Devotee Joined: Oct 07, 2004
Posts: 67
From: Alaska
Posted: 2004-12-23 01:54
You will not be disappointed Fade2Black!
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2004-12-24 02:33
Fade2Black: Thank you for your comments. I tried finding the Perfect Vision mag, but the local Barnes & Noble had the Nov/Dec issue, not the Jan/Feb issue that has the review of the 55XS955. Can you tell me how it rated as compared to the Toshiba? I am wondering what kind of rating the 55XS955 received from the mag.
Thanks
Fade2Black Sony Enthusiant Joined: Dec 04, 2004
Posts: 40
From: The Black Hole Of Cygnas X-1
Posted: 2004-12-24 09:24
Jagster1-
Sony KDF 55XS955 Thumbs up for-
Unusually bright clean picture
Stunning picture potential
Highly tweakable user menu
Excellent built in HD tuner picture
Thumbs down for-
Soft analog cable picture
Poor grayscale calibration as delivered
Marginal blacks
Some comments-
"Sony's latest Grand Wega is a worthy successor to a line of LCD RPTVs with a big and loyal following. Technically, it has few flaws, and its list of strength's and advantages over older technologies is impressive. It looks significantly better than last years models."
"For bright programming and a brightly lit room you'll have a hard time doing better no matter how much you pay. Its HDMI performance is a standout, and even its built in digital tuner makes some pretty incredible high definition pictures."
"clearly this Sony is one to audition if your looking for a fully loaded big screen at a reasonable price. Definitely recommended after calibration. Your just not gonna believe Monday Night Football!"
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2004-12-24 13:50
Fade2Black: Thanks so much for providing me with the Perfect Vision review. They clearly loved the set. I have watched Monday Night Football on the TV and it is absolutely stunning. It feels like you are right there in the stadium. Let me know if you end up getting the XS and what screen size. I would love the 60 in, but the 55 in is also very nice.
MDJ Sony Enthusiant Joined: Dec 13, 2004
Posts: 28
From:
Posted: 2004-12-24 15:34
Yeah thanks for that review info. I looked all over for that issue but its not out yet. I have the KDF-55XS955 about 3 weeks old. I love it. HD is fantastic. Hard to believe we have been watching what we have been watching.Not using any setup boxes yet, but do get 80 channels with basic/standard service. Will use the cablecard once Comcast figures out how to use it or improve the service at their end.I really like the speker set up on this set.
jdellman Sony Fan Joined: Dec 28, 2004
Posts: 6
From: Naperville, IL
Posted: 2004-12-28 00:14
Jagster1: So what did you decide? I have been monitoring this site for some time, deciding which set to go with, and trying to figure out where I should buy it, which stand to use, etc. I was also deciding betwen the 55WF655 and the 55XS955, and am leaning towards the XS. I am interested to know where you finally purchased your set. If you do not mind, I would like to follow up on your decision and contact them myself.
Thank you, I appreciate the help.
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2004-12-29 03:19
Hi Jdellman: I have been going through a long and hard process in trying to make the decision of what to buy, where to buy and if I should buy. I finally made the decision to purchase the Sony 55XS955 model. The reason I chose this model over the WF series is that I really liked the look of the set, with the extended speakers, but more importantly, I really liked the picture adjustments you can make in the Pro mode. I spent some time with the XS and adjusted the gamma, black level, while level, detail enhancer, in the Pro mode and you could really fine tune the picture. This is not possible on the WF series. I also like the fact you get a second HDMI input, which I think will come in handy when either the PS3 (I assume it will have a HDMI output) and HD DVD player come out. By the way, the Live Color that is available with the XS that is supposed to enhance the blues and greens, does not in real life situations do much to the color. There is a demo mode you can activate via the menu to demonstrate "Live Color". I did notice a few times where the blues, like in the sky, were bluer, but for the most part I could not tell any difference. The XS also has a better anti-reflective screen than the WF series. I tested this by looking at a XS and WF that were sitting side-by-side, and it was clear that the XS has less reflection in the screen. If you have a bright room, then the XS would be better at reducing the reflections.
So in summary, I like the XS series for the following reasons: 1. Incredible video adjustments available in Pro mode 2. Second HDMI Input 3. Styling 4. Better anti-reflective screen 5. Better speaker system (though intend to listen through my stereo system, so this is not as important).
If you are interested in reading a review of the 55XS955 the Jan/Feb issue of Perfect Vision magazine has a great review. I just picked this up at my local Barnes & Noble. Without going in to the entire article, the reviewer really liked the 55XS955 and had this to say in his summary:
-Unusually bright, clean picture -Stunning picture potential -Highly tweakable User Menu -Excellent built-in HD-tuner picture
On the down side he mentioned: -Soft analog-cable picture -Poor grayscale calibration as delivered (but you can adjust this) -Marginal blacks (this is true for all LCD RPT, but he did say that the blacks on this set approach that of DLPs and is quite good)
In regards to the screen size, I am choosing the 55-in. because for one, the more I looked at my room, the more I thought a 55-in would be plenty big. I currently have 15 year old 27-in Panny that is dying. So stepping up to a 55-in will be a huge jump. The other reason I chose the 55-in is price. I don't know why, but this week I saw the 55XS drop in price at one of my local retailers. Nebraska Furniture Mart dropped the price of the 55XS955 to $2,949. That price is even lower than the 55-in WF at the store. Go figure. Anyway, I went into my local Circuit City and told them of that price and the said they would not only meet it, but beat it by $50. So they quoted me a price of $2,899. I think this is a very good price for this set. Plus, Circuit City is currently offering the Sony 18 months, no interest, no payments. A great deal. You get to keep you money, drawing interest, while you are watching a great TV. You may want to go into you local CC and tell them of this deal and see if they would be willing to do the same for you. My local CC really wants to move TVs and are willing to bargain. I will not buy the CC extended warranty because it is $600 on this set, and even though it includes bulb replacement, paying that much for a warranty goes against my better judgment. I will most likely invest in a Repair Master warranty that you can purchase online for around $200 for a 4 yr. extended warranty. No bulb coverage, but it is a lot cheaper than the CC warranty.
As for the stand, I finally decided against the Sony matching stand, the GU-12. It retails for $799, and though Crutchfield was (they no longer are doing this) throwing in the stand for free, in the end I just did not like the Sony stand. For one, it sits very low (only 17-in high) and it would have been hard to fit all of my audio/video equipment into it. I have not decided on the exact stand, but I am leaning towards either the Bush VS 74337 (check Best Buy's web site as they have it on sale for around $287) or the Tech Craft equivalent which you can get at CC. In fact CC is running a very good sale on their web site of TV stands. They have some excellent stands including the Tech Craft PTV582 going for $209 (a $90 savings). Both the Bush and Tech Craft are 58-in in width and come with two glass shelves, so you can stack your equipment. I really like both of them (they are basically identical). I just need to measure the Tech Craft to see if my equipment would fit. I have measured the Bush and all of my equipment would fit.
Well that's where I am. Hope I have help you some and not added to your confusion on what to do. I would certainly check out CC and ask them to give you the price I am getting and go with the Sony financing if that interests you. Let me know what you decide as it sounds like we both have been going through the same agonizing process of deciding what is the best TV to buy.
[ This message was edited by: Jagster1 on 2004-12-29 21:46 ]
MDJ Sony Enthusiant Joined: Dec 13, 2004
Posts: 28
From:
Posted: 2004-12-29 17:32
Have the same Tv. Have you touched the R-Gain etc menu? I have been in the Pro Mode but have stayed away from the R-gain menu? Just was not sure what to do there. Otherwise this TV is the best.
jdellman Sony Fan Joined: Dec 28, 2004
Posts: 6
From: Naperville, IL
Posted: 2004-12-29 23:20
Jagster1: Thank you for the reply. I appreciate the input, especially after you purchased the set. I also noticed that in the last few days, Sony has dropped their prices on the sets I was watching. The local CC currently has the best prices, $2999 for the 55WF655 and $3099 for the 55XS955. I went there because of the financing, and intended to purchase a set. There happened to be a "off duty" CC employee from another store (go figure) and he tried talking me into the Samsung DLP HL-P5063, which had a price of $2599. When I spoke to the salesman, he also tried to sway me to the DLP. They also had a open box HL-P6163 for $3200, but I could get it for $2960.
For what its worth, I agree with your choice on the stand, except I love Sony's stand, but not just at that price. I was going to go with the Tech Craft. I also would go with the XS (I hate to admit it, but) mainly due to the styling. I am second guessing the XS now, mainly because of the width, I do not want it to overwhelm the room.
Now I am even more confused with the DLP thrown into the mix. I am currently looking into the difference betwen the DLP and the two Sonys, and it looks like there are two schools of thought, and supposedly it comes down to personal preference. I do like the fact that the Sonys have the built in HD tuner.
I read the reviews at Extreme Tech, and PC Magazine on the DLP HL-P5063, and they both gave it the very good reviews, but I have not seen anything that has compared it directly to the Sonys.
You wouldn't have happened to compared the Sonys to the DLP, would you have?
I would appreciate any input. Thanks,
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2005-01-04 00:07
Hi Jdellman: Sorry I did not post sooner. I have been away for the holidays. Trust me, I know what you are going through in trying to decide what set to purchase. Just when you thought you know what you want, something comes up that makes you second guess yourself. Part of this is that spending $3k is a lot of money and you want to make the right choice. The other part is that there are so many choice on the market that it become confusing. I can honestly say that the more educated I became on the pros and cons of each set and the different technologies, the more confused I became.
With that said, I would tell you not to put too much stock on what a certain sales clerk said to you. They all have their preferences and you never know what the motivation is for them to push one set over the other. It may have nothing to do with them actually believing a TV set is better than another, but rather some other factor such as they have more stock of a particular brand or model that they need to move. The one thing all the research gave me on the micro-displays was a knowledge that I had in speaking to sales clerks. I often knew more about a particular set than they did and I often caught them in mistakes. In the end, I had to make the decision on my own and like so many times before, my first impressions was the right one for me. I always liked the picture of the Sony LCDs, and though I like some other sets as well, the Sony's was the one set I kept coming back to.
In regards to your question on the Sony LCD's compared to a DLP, I would direct your attention to the Jan/Feb issue of The Prefect Vision mag article I reference in my previous post. The reviewer directly reviewed and compared the Sony 55XS955 to the Toshiba 52HM84 a DLP set. The reviewer did an excellent job of pointing out the pluses and minuses of each set and recommend both. It is a very good article and it was evident that both technologies can provide a excellent HD picture.
The Samsung sets that the CC employee recommend to you is not one that I personally would purchase. These sets use the HD3 chip. This is not the best Texas Instrument chip. Currently the high end TI chip is the HD2+. The HD2+ chip offers enhanced contrast. The Toshiba 52HM84 uses the HD2+ chip. Samsung reserves this chip for their higher prices sets, such as the famous CPT. Kirk model. If I was going to buy a DLP set, I would make sure it had the HD2+ chip. CC does not sell Toshiba, but Best Buy does, so if you want to preview it you can go there. Also, Crutchfield has a deal on the 52HM84 where for the price of $2,999 you get the matching TV stand and a $300 Crutchfield gift card. You can use that card to buy an Ipod (my first choice) or anything else from Crutchfield. They even have 18 months no interest, no payments on the this Toshiba.
Anyway that is my two cents worth. Don't give up on the Sony sets. They are truly outstanding in many areas and they have a unbelievable HD picture. Let me know what you decide or if I can be of any further help.
[ This message was edited by: Jagster1 on 2005-01-04 18:28 ]
jdellman Sony Fan Joined: Dec 28, 2004
Posts: 6
From: Naperville, IL
Posted: 2005-01-04 01:09
Jagster1: Thank you for the reply and the input. I had pretty much decided on the WF (versus the Samsung), but now you threw another wrench into the mix. Just kidding, I appreciate the advice. The interesting thing is that the prices I saw the week before x-mas are now $300 more. I believe I can purchase it for the price I previously saw, and the group buy has it for that price.
My thought now is to wait a week or so and see if the prices come down before the Superbowl. In the meantime, I will check out the Toshiba.
Thanks again.
bigairmaier Sony Buff Joined: Nov 30, 2004
Posts: 24
From: new mexico
Posted: 2005-01-04 11:34
Jagster, I went with the Bush stand for my 60" xs955 because I thought the Sony stand was not only too expensive but also too low and I'm glad I did, it's the perfect height for my room and seating at a fraction of the price, and looks great. I got my 60" at Best Buy for $3600.
jdellman Sony Fan Joined: Dec 28, 2004
Posts: 6
From: Naperville, IL
Posted: 2005-01-04 23:24
Jagster1: I stopped by BB tonight and checked out the Toshiba, and I have to say it looked very nice. I also checked out the article you referenced, and it was excellent. One thing I did not understand was one of the negatives of the Toshiba, the "Grayscale tracking." What is that? My other concern is the Toshiba does not have a HD tuner, but I do not know if that will be a big deal since I will have either cable or satellite. Your thoughts?
Anyway, I have switched preference to XS, but the best price I see (currently) is the $3500 via group buy. Thus, it is the Toshiba for $3018 (b/c no tax, w/stand and $300 gift card) or the XS for about $4100 (w/ tax, stand (Tech- 300), and no gift card).
Since both were recommended, I am just about ready to pull the trigger on the Toshiba.
Your help has been awesome. I did not even know about the Toshiba, or the deal at Crutchfield. Again, I appreciate it.
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2005-01-05 01:59
Hi jdellman: Glad you had a chance to preview the Toshiba. It does look like a nice set and you can get it online for a good price. The Crutchfield deal is pretty good, given you get the matching TV stand and a $300 gift card. You can find the Toshiba online for less, but I know from past experience and other posts that Crutchfield is a reputable company. As far as the knock on gray scale tracking that the Perfect Vision article noted for the Toshiba 52HM84 here is what I found out on this on the internet.
Grayscale Tracking:
The color balance of a projector at various light intensity levels determines the quality of what is called ‘grayscale tracking’. The idea is that black, white, and all shades of gray, should have the correct ratio of the three primary colors used in video projection, Red, Green and Blue. Projectors meant for HT usage, typically make white by shining just the right proportion of red green and blue light on the screen. Ideally shades of gray should have the same proportion of red, green and blue as white, but less of each color. What’s important is that this RGB ratio be the ‘correct’ ratio, and that this ratio remains constant as the intensity of the light in the image changes. This ability for the color balance to track properly with the different levels of light intensity is therefore what is called ‘grayscale tracking’.
Why is Grayscale tracking so important? Well, imagine watching a black and white movie on your color projector. Ideally whites should look white, blacks should look black and all the shades of gray should look, well gray. If the projector in the darker part of the image, used too much green, the shadows would seem a bit greenish, and that would be distracting. If the highlights looked yellow, that would also be distracting. So, it is important that all light intensity levels of ‘gray’ have the same ratio of all three colors to achieve a good black and white image on a color projector. Grayscale tracking is also important with color images, as one does not want the color of an object to change as the level of illumination changes, or is in a shadow. Good grayscale tracking, however, requires careful calibration – typically beyond that done by the manufacturer or easily done by a user without test equipment.
That is probably more information than you wanted to know, but it at least now you know what grayscale tracking means in relation to a projection TV.
If you still like the Sony 55XS955 I wouldn't give up on it yet. This is the set I ended up getting and it may come down in price again. What you may want to do to protect yourself is call Crutchfield and see if you can find out how long the Toshiba deal is to run. Regardless what they tell you, check their site daily to see if they show the offer about to expire. I know for the Sony 55XS they did show that the offer was going to expire. You could then wait and see if the XS comes down in price. An interesting thing I found out today is that CC no longer lists the 55XS on their web site. They have the 60XS, but the 55XS has been removed--interesting. Not sure what this means. Maybe they are out of stock or perhaps they are no longer going to carry the 55XS. You may want to check back with your local CC store and see if they have any 55XS and if so how much they would be willing to sell it to you. If they are getting rid of their stock, maybe they will be inclined to give you a good price. Regardless of what they tell you, you can monitor the XS prices over the next couple of weeks and see if they drop again. Just a thought.
As for the HDTV tuner, from what I know, if you are not intending to get OTA TV and you are going to use Cable or Satellite, then having a built-in HDTV turner does not provide you with any advantages as you will be bypassing the built-in tuner for the cable/satellite box.
Hope I have not confused you more. Keep me posted on what you decide to do. I now what to know what you end up getting as i know you are going through the same painful process I went through for about a month before I made the purchase.
[ This message was edited by: Jagster1 on 2005-01-05 12:02 ]
jdellman Sony Fan Joined: Dec 28, 2004
Posts: 6
From: Naperville, IL
Posted: 2005-01-06 00:34
Jagster1: I hate to tell you this, but I went with the Toshiba, through Crutchfield. I made the decision based on a couple factors, namely:
1) Price- Even if the price came down, I only expected it to come down to around $3000, and I would have probably paid tax and needed a stand, all told it would have been about $3700, versus the Toshiba for $3000 (with stand, no taxes and delivery) less the $300 store credit, so it was about $1000 different.
2) Size- I really liked the XS, but I was worried it would overwhelm the room (in other words, the wife would go nuts).
3) Stand- I liked the Toshiba with the stand.
I realize that the Toshiba may not be better than the XS,and I am not happy about the HD tuner, but I could not justify the price difference. Also, I have been spending so much time on the decision it was getting foolish.
Again, I really appreciate your help, you have been great. Thank you,
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2005-01-06 20:55
Hi jdellman: So glad to hear you bought a RPTV. I think you will be really happy with the Toshiba 52HM84. The review in the in The Perfect Vision showed that the Toshiba is a great TV and one that I am sure you will enjoy for years. I really like the way the set looked on the matching stand you will be getting. I agree with your analysis in that the 55XS955 would likely not fall below $3k and with the Crutchfield deal of the stand, no tax and the $300 gift card, it was a deal that was hard to refuse. You throw in their no interest, no payment financing, and it is truly a great deal. Also the fact that set is a tad smaller than the Sony should help you on the home front :>)
Let me know how you like it once you get it set-up and running. I am sure you will love it and the picture will blow you away. Once you have a big screen, it is really hard to go back and watch a normal size screen.
Take care and enjoy your new TV when it arrives.
jdellman Sony Fan Joined: Dec 28, 2004
Posts: 6
From: Naperville, IL
Posted: 2005-01-08 00:43
Jagster1: Thanks again. The televsion will be delivered Thursday, so I will let you know how it is once it is set up. I am sure I will love it, how can you not? Hopefully I will get it all figured out by the time the Superbowl.
Take care.
echelonphoto Sony Fan Joined: Jan 22, 2005
Posts: 3
From:
Posted: 2005-01-22 18:07
I had the toshiba...in my estimation, unless I had a lemon is that the Sony is far superior in terms of color sharpness and overall watchability. Everybody in my family noticed the dif right away. The toshiba is esp terrible with less than perfect DVD's or other sources. I think the color palette on the sony is much richer and even when enhancing saturation on the the Tosh...you cannot match the sony
bigairmaier Sony Buff Joined: Nov 30, 2004
Posts: 24
From: new mexico
Posted: 2005-01-24 19:12
my wife helped me decide on the 60XS955, she wouldn't let me get a TV thats less than 60", I love her! We also looked at the 70"XBR and 82" Mitsu. I got the Bush stand for $287 and 60XS for $3600, I've gotten compliments on the Bush stand and wouldn't pay the $799 Sony's asking for the stand, especially since the Bush sits 3" higher and I thought the Sony stand was a little low for my room and seating.
Jagster1 Sony Buff Joined: Dec 11, 2004
Posts: 22
From: Lincoln, NE
Posted: 2005-01-27 20:24
Hi echelonphoto and bigairmaier: I agree that the Sony XS955 has a great picture. I spent several weeks comparing the picture to just about every microsystem out there and I kept coming back to the Sony. There colors are just so bright and vivid. I love the fact you can tweak the picture setting in the Pro mode and really customize how the picture looks. I ended up getting the Bush wood TV stand from Circuit City. It has two glass doors on either end and my stereo equipment fit perfectly in the stand. The wood look is very rich and my 55XS955 fits it perfectly. Now that I have had my TV for a couple of weeks now and been able to watch HD TV, I am totally spoiled. I find myself watching a lot of nature shows on Discovery HD and IDNet. I watched the Steelers vs Patriot game on Sunday in HD and the picture was out of this world. I could see the divot marks in the field-unbelievable.
Well like each of you I am a very happy with my choice and I am having a lot of fun with this Sony.
dartmouth Sony Enthusiant Joined: Jan 16, 2005
Posts: 49
From: New Jersey
Posted: 2005-01-31 16:40
I have the 60XS and would suggest ordering it online if you really need to watch the $. Try ecost.com although I bought mine from ShopSunshine.com. Ecost uses fed ex so you'll get it like next day or 2 at most. And shipping was under $200. I love, I said love, my 60XS and thought of buying ALL the others, WE, WF, XS even XBR. Got the Cable Card and use that for my stations. Most of the times regular stations have a really great picture but HD stations on the XS are superb! Bought the Tech Kraft stand for $250 and the XS for $3145. Also bought Sony's new NS975 DVD Player with HDMI and ran that into the TV using an HDMI cable. I had my Cable company install the card and their HD Atlantic Scientific Cable Box and they ran component video and audio cables to the TV. The guy gave me 2 - 6 ft Optical Cables for free to run my surround sound from the audio receiver to the dvd player and the cable box. Hopefully this info will help you get the TV you want for the price you can afford.
dartmouth Sony Enthusiant Joined: Jan 16, 2005
Posts: 49
From: New Jersey
Posted: 2005-01-31 16:55 PS.If your wondering why I installed both the Cable Card and the HD Cable Box, it's because if you want to use some of the services available with Comcast, such as pay per view, Comcast Digital Channel Guide with Info, or HBO/STRZ ondemand, you need to go through the box. But, that's ok cause your TV handles them all without a problem.
dartmouth Sony Enthusiant Joined: Jan 16, 2005
Posts: 49
From: New Jersey
Posted: 2005-01-31 16:55 PS.If your wondering why I installed both the Cable Card and the HD Cable Box, it's because if you want to use some of the services available with Comcast, such as pay per view, Comcast Digital Channel Guide with Info, or HBO/STRZ ondemand, you need to go through the box. But, that's ok cause your TV handles them all without a problem.
[ This message was edited by: dartmouth on 2005-01-31 16:56 ]
bigairmaier Sony Buff Joined: Nov 30, 2004
Posts: 24
From: new mexico
Posted: 2005-01-31 19:03
dartmouth, since you already have Comcast digital HD you should go another $6 a month for the twin tuner SA 8000 HD DVR(combo cablebox/DVR) that gives you the ability to record two HD shows simultaneously while watching a third previously recorded HD show. It's awesome. Jagster, the Bush wood stand sounds really nice, I didn't see that one but we really like the metal and glass Bush stand we got too.
TTV Sony Devotee Joined: Jan 27, 2005
Posts: 60
From: Chicago area
Posted: 2005-02-09 14:08
I have the 60"WF LCD. I preferred the overall look (cabinet style) of the WF vs. the XS. The XS does have the better audio but I have an excellent audio system so I don't need the XS audio features.
Also, I find the speaker styling a bit odd on the XS and it makes the unit appear bigger than it should.
I was worried about giving up some of the added controls of the XS vs. the WF. But, I'm here to tell you, the pict. of the WF is excellent even compared to the XS side by side.
I just had another change to see this for myself at CC the other day.
There was a 60"XS next to a 55"WF. I tweaked both in their "pro" mode. I used the additional tweeks offered by the XS but it made very little difference in overall quality. Maybe if I had those features in my home setting I could extract a bit better performance from the XS.
But, overall the WF fit my needs and likes better AND it cost less!
You can't beat that when something you prefer actually costs less.
Both are excellent TV's and the price difference isn't tremendous if you want the XS additional features or you prefer the styling.
For me the price difference gave me a nice stand for my WF.
TT
KMDO Sony Buff Joined: Feb 15, 2005
Posts: 16
From: PRK
Posted: 2005-02-16 04:54
TTV I agree on the styling preferance for the WF also, just wish it had the extra hdmi and color controls but the style of the tv is turned on 24/7.
bigairmaier Sony Buff Joined: Nov 30, 2004
Posts: 24
From: new mexico
Posted: 2005-02-17 19:28
OK, I'll weigh in on the styling preferences too. Everybody has their own taste. I prefer the XS for its more contemporary appearance, everyone that sees it has to try and peak behind it to see how deep it is because it appears to be real thin like a plasma. I also think the side mounted speakers look real sharp and futuristic even though I also have the external amplifier with 5.1 surround. Both are very nice and you can't go wrong with either one. That being said, I would still take the 60"WF over a 55"XS, because despite what woman will tell you, size does matter! I got my 60"XS for $3600 so I didn't think there was that big a difference in the price.
[ This message was edited by: bigairmaier on 2005-02-17 19:35 ]
TTV Sony Devotee Joined: Jan 27, 2005
Posts: 60
From: Chicago area
Posted: 2005-02-18 14:19
That's a great price for the 60XS.
I got my 60WF for $3200 and NO tax. I couldn't pass it up.
The XS would have been fine for me if it would have had more
picture tuning than it does. As it stands it only has a bit more control of some color options. However, side by side comparison showed me that the WF and XS perform equally. So, it came down to what I wanted to pay for and what I needed to pay for.
I have a great HT setup so I didn't need any of the speakers. It would be great if TV makers would offer speakerless options for their TV lines and save us and them the cost of installing audio processing, amplification, and speakers.
For me, the WF made more sense and I didn't like the speaker thingy sticking out like that. It distracted my eyes from the picture as the background comes seems to come through.
But, you're absolutely right, it is a matter of preference and taste as to what one thinks is actually more modern or high tech.
TT
hoopofficial2 Sony Devotee Joined: Sep 17, 2004
Posts: 52
From:
Posted: 2005-02-22 15:04
I just sold my KDF50WE655 and moved to the KDF60XS955. I struggled with the WF vs XS decision too. Personally, I feel the XS did not bring enough to the table but I went with it because I liked the way it looked. I paid $3,330 through a Bernies dealer in Western MA. and got a $279 4 year warranty + free delivery. I could have paid $3,130 for the WF model but like the bean counter that I am, I was getting a better deal on the XS model from retail so that is how I justified spending the additional $200. I'm sure that I will love it but was it worth the $200. Ah, that is the question. Either way, I think I got a good deal even after figuring the tax implications.
jttar Sony Master Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
Posted: 2005-02-22 22:33
On 2005-02-22 15:04, hoopofficial2 wrote: I just sold my KDF50WE655 and moved to the KDF60XS955. I'm sure that I will love it but was it worth the $200. Ah, that is the question. Either way, I think I got a good deal even after figuring the tax implications.
hoopofficial2,
You got a great deal on your XS955 and as far as it being worth an extra two hundred dollar more over the WF655, you bet. Even if you don't have use for the extra HDMI or extra video calibrations you bought the set that appealed to you. Considering how many hours you will spend looking at this set, it's always better to have the one you wanted rather than kicking yourself in the pants a month down the road for not spending the extra $$'s to get the one you really wanted. When I finally narrowed my choice to these same two models I decided that the price difference wasn't going to be a factor in my decision. It just so happens in my case that I preferred the look of the WF series (not PQ, just the chassis). That's why there is chocolate and vanilla. Enjoy that new XS.
Joe
hoopofficial2 Sony Devotee Joined: Sep 17, 2004
Posts: 52
From:
Posted: 2005-02-23 10:57
Joe, you are correct, I would have been kicking myself. I have done so before. The XS is coming in tomorrow and I can't wait to hook it up to my Denon 3910 DVD player and let it fly. Unfortunately, my HD service from Charter Commuications sucks otherwise I would be going there first. You can only watch so much of Discovery HD. Thanks.
Ron
jttar Sony Master Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
Posted: 2005-02-23 22:56
Ron,
I know that your going to love your new XS. Where these TV's really shine is when your viewing HD. You might want to consider buying an OTA antenna to view all your local channels HD broadcasts the picture truly is phenomenal. I agree that Discovery is great but you can only watch so much before it's time to surf.
Joe
hoopofficial2 Sony Devotee Joined: Sep 17, 2004
Posts: 52
From:
Posted: 2005-02-24 08:57
Joe, I would love to do that but not all my local channels broadcast in HD yet. The one that does in pretty far away so I don't think I will be able to pick it up. Do you have one mounted on your roof or is it just a desktop version? Complicating matters even further, is that I live at the base of a mountain. I bought a desktop version on could not get anything. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks.
jttar Sony Master Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
Posted: 2005-02-24 22:56
Ron,
I am fortunate enough to have a full attic and have a rooftop antenna that I bought from Radio Shack for $49(US) mounted in it. I bought the antenna two years ago during the winter and the weather here in Chicago was too severe to mount it on the roof. Not wanting to wait I set it up in the attic. The signal is so strong that I have never moved it to the roof and am content to leave it right where it is. Given the fact that you are at the base of a mountain I would imagine that you would need at least a rooftop antenna to recieve a strong signal. HERE is a site that is pretty cool. If you put in your location (ZIP Code) it will tell you what type of antenna you need and I believe if you follow the links it will show what HD channels are available to you. Hope it helps.
Joe
xavier20 Sony Fan Joined: Apr 05, 2005
Posts: 4
From:
Posted: 2005-04-05 16:48
I have the KDF-60XS955 but i don't get any sound thru the OPTICAL Out. I have the TV hook (S-Video Cable) up to a dish network reciver and the TV hook up to the A/V using optical cable. But I don't get any soung thru the OPTICAL OUT....WHY????
jttar Sony Master Joined: Feb 28, 2003
Posts: 9156
From: Chicago,IL, USA
Posted: 2005-04-05 19:53
xavier,
See my reply on the seperate thread you started asking the same question.
Joe
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Posted: 2004-12-18 00:53 
Posted: 2004-12-18 11:25 
Posted: 2004-12-19 01:57 
Posted: 2004-12-21 11:31 
PS.If your wondering why I installed both the Cable Card and the HD Cable Box, it's because if you want to use some of the services available with Comcast, such as pay per view, Comcast Digital Channel Guide with Info, or HBO/STRZ ondemand, you need to go through the box. But, that's ok cause your TV handles them all without a problem. 
You can't beat that when something you prefer actually costs less.
(S-Video Cable) up to a dish network reciver and the TV hook up to the A/V using 
optical cable. But I don't get any soung thru the OPTICAL OUT....WHY????