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View topic - Help: haze/fuzzy layer on bright solid HD background

Help: haze/fuzzy layer on bright solid HD background

This Forum is questions on any problems you could have with your Sony Televsion set (i.e. Sony Wega grainess problem, cable problems, so forth)

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by onesony » Mon Jan 03, 2005 7:41 am


Hi all,

I just bought a 55" RPLCD KDF55wf655. One thing that bothers me is a sparklings layer on HD signals when the background is bright and solid: There is a layer of haze and puzziness, especially when the picture is moving.

On a close inspection, it seems that
(i) not all HD programs have this effect
(ii) the layer also exists for the darker background, but it is not as distracting as the bright background such as a sky, for example.

I have heard the SDE on LCD tv, however, I am not sure the SDE effect is what I observed. Yes, there is a screen on the TV when I sit up close, but that does not bother me and I can not see it when I am sitting far enough back, rather, it is the sparkling layer that really distract me from enjoying the picture.

I appreciate if you can help me determing

1) is my TV set a defect one?

2) is some program, even on HD, caused the effect? or you have observed the similar effect.

Thanks for all your inputs and happy New Year,
Onesony

p.s. I am using TimeWarner Cable w/ Scientific Atlantic HD box and component video cable at video 5 input.
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by jttar » Mon Jan 03, 2005 8:00 pm

onesony,

Greetings and welcome. I wish I could be of help. I own this same TV and am not experiencing any of the problems that you describe. Can you better describe the "sparklings layer" or the "puzziness" you refer to? Even up close I cannot see any signs of the SDE.

Joe
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by onesony » Tue Jan 04, 2005 6:32 am


Hi Jtarr,

Here are two examples:

When I watch a nature program in HD or the show "Switch places" (?) where two families decorating each others rooms, the bright walls
or the background blue sky always flickering.
Or at least I perceive it that way. When the camera moving around, there could be a
faint layer of fussyness on top of the sky or walls that stay on the screen for a while. Very short time, but enough to attract my vision to focus on.

Another ecample is on some of the Circuit City advertisement, the big bright red circle in their logo have that effect too. I noticed in the store that some program on the display sets have this effects too, but it does not seems as obvious as mine.

I wonder if all LCD cell are put together the same, i.e., could it be that mine screen is defective that some light is leaking out, or
that I am more senstive to the SDE effect?

Thanks,
Onesony
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by andyross » Tue Jan 04, 2005 1:20 pm

It sounds like you are describing common MPEG encoding artifacts. When there are rapid changes in the video, and the bandwidth is narrow, you start to get more and more blockiness. Depending on how bad it is, it first looks like fuzziness.

Many HD channels are somehwat restricted from what the can do. Many non-movie digital channels are SEVERELY restricted, down to VHS resolution or worse. Finally, the newer DVR's always buffer the video. This should have no effect on digital channels (which are buffered as is), but analog channels are digitized, and show obvious artifacts.

Even on a fully analog connection, you may see it if there is some digital conversion somewhere along the transmission sequence.
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by MDJ » Tue Jan 04, 2005 4:34 pm

I have the Sony KDF-55XS955 and notice it on some channels. Cnn seems worse. It seems like parts of the face fuzz up real quick then back to a clearer look. Its like the sharpness is trying to sharpen. Its quick. Its only on certain channels so i was thinking its more of the signal that comes from the station through comcast to me. I'm not using Digital as my picture is better without it. I am annoyed by it and the MPEG issue the guy mentioned above could be true. IS it happening on every channel and your DVDs???
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by onesony » Tue Jan 04, 2005 8:11 pm


Actually the effect I discribed are mainly on HD signals. Since most HD moive channels and analog channels are darker and have much more background noise, the effect is not that clear and not bothering me.

A funny thing is that the effect tend to bother me more when I sit back further from TV ... I can easily distracted by the flickering when a light backgtound appears on the screen. However, when I come close to TV to inspect the picture, I can see the underlying screen clearly and it does not flickering that much and borthingsome.

I still have time to return (exchange) the TV from CC, but since not all people think this is an issue, I began to think maybe i am just too sensitive to the light change on screen as some of my friend does not bothered by what I see.
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by MDJ » Wed Jan 05, 2005 5:59 am

I agree I am to sensitive to alot of things. The fan was driving me nuts at the beginning and now i barely notice it. I paid alot of money and do expect perfection but going up from a 15 yr old CRT big 46 inch tv to a 55 LCD the picture is so much clearer maybe we are just not use to the clarity. Hopefully when signals improve and become more uniform in the years to come there will be more consistency.
Just a thought.
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by notech » Wed Jan 05, 2005 6:10 pm

I think I know what you are describing, but I see in on many channels, not just HD, especially on bright backgrounds.  It looks like an ancient computer monitor with sparklies in it.  Or sugar cookie colored sprinkles all crushed up (tiny) and spewed on the screen

I agree it's the signal.  Some channels are crystal clear.

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by onesony » Thu Jan 06, 2005 5:04 am



I visited BB, CC, and Tweeters. I watched the 42" 55" and 60" display models and I have to say that I did not observe the same effect that
is on mine.  I think I will either return it or exchange for another one.

Will the screen door effect looks wors on some sets than others?
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by notech » Thu Jan 06, 2005 4:34 pm

onesony - the reason you're not seeing it in the stores is, they feed an HD tape from a hard drive to the sets on display.  You just won't know what a different set will display until you get it home and hook it up to the same signal. 

I'm convinced the only way to get a super clear PQ is with a pristine signal and probably a plasma to clean up the noise.  RPT LCD was a trade off for me in price, longevity and no burn in issues.

Some ppl suggest taking a dvd that you are familiar with to the store and playing it on the tv of your choice.  If the store won't let you, I'd shop elsewhere.  Wish I had done that before I bought mine.

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