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Agoraquest • View topic - Blu-ray players delayed

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View topic - Blu-ray players delayed

Blu-ray players delayed

This forum addresses questions on Blu-Ray

Moderator: jttar

by retate » Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:45 pm

Ed,

Any indication as to whether this new schedule will allow them to include HDMI 1.3? 

It appears that HDMI 1.3 is now an approved specification.  The following is from the press release.


New HDMI 1.3 capabilities include:



  • Higher speed: HDMI 1.3 increases its single-link bandwidth from 165MHz (4.95 gigabits per second) to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbps) to support the demands of future high definition display devices, such as higher resolutions, Deep Color and high frame rates. In addition, built into the HDMI 1.3 specification is the technical foundation that will let future versions of HDMI reach significantly higher speeds.


  • Deep color: HDMI 1.3 supports 30-bit, 36-bit and 48-bit (RGB or YCbCr) color depths, up from the 24-bit depths in previous versions of the HDMI specification.



    • Lets HDTVs and other displays go from millions of colors to billions of colors


    • Eliminates on-screen color banding, for smooth tonal transitions and subtle gradations between colors


    • Enables increased contrast ratio


    • Can represent many times more shades of gray between black and white. At 30-bit pixel depth, four times more shades of gray would be the minimum, and the typical improvement would be eight times or more


  • Broader color space: HDMI 1.3 removes virtually all limits on color selection.



    • Next-generation “xvYCC” color space supports 1.8 times as many colors as existing HDTV signals


    • Lets HDTVs display colors more accurately


    • Enables displays with more natural and vivid colors


  • New mini connector: With small portable devices such as HD camcorders and still cameras demanding seamless connectivity to HDTVs, HDMI 1.3 offers a new, smaller form factor connector option.


  • Lip Sync: Because consumer electronics devices are using increasingly complex digital signal processing to enhance the clarity and detail of the content, synchronization of video and audio in user devices has become a greater challenge and could potentially require complex end-user adjustments. HDMI 1.3 incorporates an automatic audio/video synching capability that allows devices to perform this synchronization automatically with accuracy.


  • New lossless audio formats: In addition to HDMI’s current ability to support high-bandwidth uncompressed digital audio and currently-available compressed formats (such as Dolby® Digital and DTS), HDMI 1.3 adds additional support for new, lossless compressed digital audio formats Dolby® TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio™.
For those interested in more information see http://www.hdmi.org/.

Bob




On 2006-07-12 23:21, edconline wrote:
There was a release today stating that the reason for the delay was that Sony wanted to make SURE that when it does come out it is a true reference class piece, unsurpassed by any other manufacturer on the market, and that it would truly showcase that Sony is dedicated to the format and is capable of making the highest quality players in the world. That it would be the definitive player for the technology and exploit everything that Blu Ray has to offer. I don't know about you, but I've got no problem waiting until Oct 25th for a player like THAT.
Ed
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by edconline » Fri Jul 14, 2006 9:51 pm

Bob,
I had wondered about that very same thing when I read the release, having read that the HDMI 1.3 spec had been finalized just prior, however no details were given re: HDMI 1.3 support. Even if it doesn't support hdmi 1.3, you will still be able to use the HDMI out or the 5.1 analog out to enjoy uncompressed multi-channel audio.

Also, it should be noted that the Blu Ray format includes PCM 5.1 uncompressed as a mandatory audio layer on the disc, whereas the new dolby and dts codecs are optional. In fact, none of the Blu Ray discs I have seen thus far have included any of the next-gen audio codecs, but all have had the PCM 5.1 uncompressed which can be transmitted to any reciever equipped with either the HDMI or multi channel in jacks.
 
Perhaps Sony, and the other Blu Ray backers, have decided that with the uncertainty that was surrounding hdmi 1.3 and the need to then upgrade your receiver to enjoy the new formats, that they needed to build in next gen audio quality that can be enjoyed now, and have focused on the uncompressed PCM streams for the time being until HDMI 1.3 becomes standard in receivers.

I guess only time will tell!

Ed
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by rb » Sat Jul 15, 2006 7:22 am

What it the bit rate and sample frequency of the 5.1 uncompressed PCM soundtrack?  How many Sony receivers are capable of receiving a multi channel 24/96 PCM stream?  Every Sony receiver that I've used would default to 2 channel stereo when fed a 24/96 signal digitally.
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by Maxxwire » Sat Jul 15, 2006 12:09 pm

HDMI v1.3 is spec'd for 8 channels of 24/192 PCM.

I have read that in the near future the different HD Formats like Dolby True HD and DTS HD Master will be transmitted in their respective losslessly compressed naitive Format and there will no longer be any need to convert them into 24/192 PCM because by that time Receivers will be equipped with the required Digital Decoding.

~Maxx~



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by edconline » Sat Jul 15, 2006 1:45 pm

rb,
The only signal transmission for multi channel PCM at 96/24 or 196/24 digitally is HDMI, but all the versions of HDMI support this, so the 7100ES is really the only Sony receiver at this point that will accept it. Any sony receiver with the analog multi channel inputs however, should be able to receive the PCM stream this way as well. From what I have been told, the uncompressed PCM is 196/24 but no word on the bitrate yet, when I get a chance to test it I will let you know.

With an HDMI 1.3 capable receiver yes, you can feed it the information via HDMI 1.3 out of a player and it does the decoding, however whether the decoding happens in the player itself or the receiver should not impact the quality of the sound, assuming the decoders were the same.. That is why I am pleased Sony is using the decoder in the BDPS1 istelf, that means I won't have to replace my 7100ES (Although if the 9100ES comes out with HDMI 1.3 I probably would, if for nothing other than the 200WPC)

Ed
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by retate » Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:03 am



Given that HDMI 1.3 appears to be one key to the PS3 release from a marketing perspective it would seem like Sony will want to get other parts of their product line to support HDMI 1.3 as fast as possible.  I noted recently that although Denon has done a minor update to their AVR-5805 appending a "MK2" both they and Sony appear to be overdue for new high end receivers.

The following in regards to projected product availability is from the hdmi.org site.  Whether anyone will be fast enough to get product out by Christmas 2006 will be interesting to watch.

Bob

--------------------------------
Q: When will products with HDMI 1.3 capabilities be available to the public?
Products using HDMI 1.3 capabilities are expected to become available this year starting with the PS3. Displays, DVDs and A/V Receivers are expected to ship early in 2007.
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by retate » Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:14 pm

According to AVGUIDE there is a problem with noise reduction being enabled in the Samsung Blu-ray player.  I have appended a brief description of the problem from a July 18 posting.  For the full posting try the following link.

Bob

http://www.avguide.com/news/2006/07/20/exclusive-early-samsung-
blu-ray-players-ship-with-chip-mistake/




------------------------------------
Don Eklund, executive vice president of advanced technologies at Sony Pictures, noticed that the player’s image did not match the quality of the master tapes from which the Blu-ray titles were encoded. He contacted Samsung, whose engineers determined that the noise-reduction circuit in the player’s Genesis scaler chip was enabled, causing the picture to soften significantly.


According to Jim Sanduski, senior vice president of marketing for Samsung’s Audio and Video Products Group, “Samsung is currently working to revise the default settings on the noise-reduction circuit in the Genesis scaler chip to sharpen the picture. All future Samsung BD-P1000 production will have this revision and we are working to develop a firmware update for existing product.”
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